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“You cannot attribute nonsense to god.”
Sparky
sparkindarkness
There is an old quote, or a variation on a quote saying that we cannot attribute nonsense to god. It’s used to debunk people trying to question various attributes of god, especially omnipotence - such as “can god create square circles.” And it is very true - there is, after all, no such thing as a circle or a square, just a shape that we perceive DESCRIBE as such, so while an omnipotent being may change the shape, we will describe the shape by means we are used to.

But that’s kind of irrelevant to the true potential of this quote, I feel. We cannot attribute nonsense to god - but how many of the followers of the Christian, Muslim (and, to a lesser extent, Jewish) god(s) do just this?

Think of the linguistic descriptors that are so often used to describe these gods:

Good. Perfect. Merciful. Benevolent. Loving.


Now consider some of the other descriptors we have: Jealous. Angry. Wrathful.
Consider some of the actions and stances large numbers of these gods’ followers espouse in the name of their god. They advocate discrimination - on race, gender and sexuality. Some of them even go so far to call for and actively participate in violence. Some commit murder, some kill themselves in the process of doing so. Some torture and oppress people and groups horrendously. Many certainly speak of their pet hatred in the most hateful of terms (personally I’ve been referred to as anything from a blight to a disease to a cancer to a daemon because of my sexuality). I have seen smugness and arrogance to disdain to utter contempt to outright hatred towards other faiths.

This hatred, this violence, this inhumanity to man is done in the name of and by followers of these deities - by people who believe that those first descriptors still apply

Well, I say to them “you cannot attribute nonsense to god.” It is a NONSENSE to believe that a god is both perfect and jealous or merciful and wrathful. It is a NONSENSE to believe a loving god would condemn people to an eternity of torture because of their sex life. It is a NONSENSE to believe a benevolent being would want you to oppress or abuse people for ANY reason. It is a NONSENSE to believe a compassionate god would want you to insult and attack people. It is a NONSENSE to believe a perfect god would be so insecure as to advocate violence against those who do not follow him or who worship him in an incorrect fashion.

These extremist, hateful and damaging members of these (and other) religions need to stop and think. Use the brains they believe their god gave them and think. If their god is loving, merciful, compassionate and benevolent then maybe they should be too. Because at the moment they are covering him with nonsense, blanketing him with it and choking him in it that many of us on the outside cannot see him at all - just the vast sheet of hateful nonsense. I don’t believe in their god, but I do believe their faith deserves better than that.

I believe the correct response to this would be a very hearty "AMEN!!!!"
*grin*

The full version of that is "Forever and ever Amen Ra".


Then how do you explain Monty Python?!

;)

No-one need ever explain Monty Python :) It is the universal constant, it just is :)

A family member who (not unlike myself) went from Catholic to atheist once remarked to me, "No, I don't believe in a god anymore, but if there is one, he's a jerk!"

There's a saying you've probably heard that's popular on bumper stickers: "God save me from your followers."


I can completely see her point because the way some of the even major churches portray their god make me think we should run from him rather than worship him

LOL, not heard that one but I have seen a: "I love Jesus, but his fanclub sucks"

One day, I sincerely hope that you will no longer feel the need to write stuff like this. I won't hold my breath though :(

There's one big problem with this idea: trying to get these people to THINK is the exact opposite of what they're trained to do. From the very beginning it's continuously beaten into them that people are evil, wrong, bad, nasty, tainted, bad bad bad BAD bad, and nothing at all good can ever come from anything human. People may have free will, but there is only ever one RIGHT way to use it, and that ain't the way you'd come up with on your own. Many forms of Christianity are basically centered around a constant yearning to more or less expunge free will-- follow the will of god, leave your life in the hands of god, etc. Faith, the way it's commonly described, is suspension of reason. DON'T USE YOUR BRAIN. YOUR BRAIN SUCKS. GOD IS SMARTER THAN YOU. APOLOGIZE FOR BEING HUMAN, DON'T THINK FOR YOURSELF. EVER. Etc. It turns into one long effort in trying to give back free will and identity, cringing from personal responsibility, and all but trying to crawl back into the womb. That's what makes these people so damned annoying to deal with.

Which is what makes it so heartbreaking to try and get through,. There is NO thought and no reason to debate against or appeal to. No matter what conscience, respect, empathy or reason says the haters will not listen or understand because their hate is implaccable and unchallengable. And it is so sad because it is linked to this idea that thinking itself is sinful or pointless or flawed - because god has done it all for thm already so they don't have to any more - especially sicne they consider thought to be inherently evil (because mankind is so evil/flawed broken) *sigh* There's no real way to fight that

They cannot think, it's not allowed. There is no introspection it's been weeded out. Only those who are partially or badly indoctrinated have any hope but even then external influences are usually meaningless.

This applies to those indoctrinated from birth, those indoctrinated later especially against their will have a better chance of combating indoctrination.


Thinking is sinful - god has done the thinking. To think is to challenge god. *sigh* I wish they could get past that and see that they wouldn't have been given brains if they weren't expected to use them - except... they have to think to learn it's ok to think

There is some of that but we'd be down a few pegs if not for the free thinkers who were able to work around the rules or flat out break them.

The process is probably documented somewhere but it's not like people giving you rules it's deeper than that. You don't know there are rules it's just the way it is. A cell or crypt you don't even know is holding you.



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